Comparing Three Roads from Seven Cows to Seven Trumpets

Tas Walker and Myself on C14 : Glacial Maximum and End · Interim III, Flood to Abraham with Syncellus · Continuing Interim III to Joseph in Egypt · Comparing Three Roads from Seven Cows to Seven Trumpets

St. Jerome

If Djoser had been dated by Cambridge halflife to 2800 BC in 1950, the remaining C-14 would have been 56.293 %. A full Cambridge half life is however further back.

However, as usual, this presumes that the C-14 content back then was c. 100% of the present value.

Also, the Libby date is off, so instead of 4750 years, 4892,5 years. 4892 years gives a content of 55.334 %.

Why is this important?

Well, Djoser, as well as Neferkasokar seem to be Joseph's pharao. ... This means that carbon dated 2800 BC = 1728 or rather less, later, BC. ... Carbon dated 2800 = 1709. ... The carbon content in Joseph's time when Jacob died was therefore about 87.636 pmc.

This Morning I Read it's 77 and 68 Years of Radiocarbon
http://creavsevolu.blogspot.com/2017/02/this-morning-i-read-its-77-and-68-years.html

Syncellus

XXXVII 1901 BC

89.685 pmc : 2801

Jacob +

1881 BC

Continuing Interim III to Joseph in Egypt
http://creavsevolu.blogspot.com/2017/06/continuing-interim-iii-to-joseph-in.html

Correcting error carbon dated 2800 BC = 1881 BC. 920 extra years, 89.468 pmc.

2801
1881
0920

Ussher, cited in Haydock comment:

Year of the World 2315, Year before Christ 1689.

GENESIS - Chapter 49
Haydock's Catholic Bible Commentary, 1859 edition
http://haydock1859.tripod.com/id376.html

2800
1635
1165

Carbon dated 2800 BC = 1635 BC, 1165 extra years and that means 86.855 pmc.

Time taken according to the three:

500 BC = carbon dated 500 BC, no extra years, 100 pmc.

1881		1709		1635
0501		0509		0505
1380		1200		1130

Real dates according to Syncellus:

i 1881 BC		ij 1842 BC		iij 1802 BC
iu 1763 BC		u 1723 BC		uj 1684 BC
uij 1644 BC		uiij 1605 BC		ix 1566 BC
x 1526 BC		xj 1487 BC		xij 1447 BC
xiij 1408 BC		xiu 1368 BC		xu 1329 BC
xuj 1290 BC		xuij 1250 BC		xuiij 1211 BC
xix 1171 BC		xx 1132 BC		xxj 1092 BC
xxij 1053 BC		xxiij 1014 BC		xxiu 974 BC
xxu 935 BC		xxuj 895 BC		xxuij 856 BC
xxuiij 816 BC		xxix 777 BC		xxx 738 BC
xxxj 698 BC		xxxij 659 BC		xxxiij 619 BC
xxxiu 580 BC		xxxu 540 BC		xxxuj 501 BC

Extra years and percent modern carbon:

i 920 89.468 pmc		ij 894 89.75 pmc		iij 867 90.043 pmc
iu 841 90.327 pmc		u 815 90.612 pmc		uj 789 90.897 pmc
uij 762 91.194 pmc		uiij 736 91.482 pmc		ix 710 91.77 pmc
x 683 92.07 pmc		xj 657 92.36 pmc		xij 631 92.651 pmc
xiij 605 92.943 pmc		xiu 578 93.247 pmc		xu 552 93.541 pmc
xuj 526 93.835 pmc		xuij 499 94.142 pmc		xuiij 473 94.439 pmc
xix 447 94.736 pmc		xx 421 95.035 pmc		xxj 394 95.346 pmc
xxij 368 95.646 pmc		xxiij 342 95.947 pmc		xxiu 315 96.261 pmc
xxu 289 96.564 pmc		xxuj 263 96.869 pmc		xxuij 237 97.174 pmc
xxuiij 210 97.492 pmc		xxix 184 97.799 pmc		xxx 158 98.107 pmc
xxxj 131 98.428 pmc		xxxij 105 98.738 pmc		xxxiij 79 99.049 pmc
xxxiu 53 99.361 pmc		xxxu 26 99.686 pmc		xxxuj 0 100 pmc

Apparent carbon dates:

i 2801 BC		ij 2736 BC		iij 2669 BC
iu 2604 BC		u 2538 BC		uj 2473 BC
uij 2406 BC		uiij 2341 BC		ix 2276 BC
x 2209 BC		xj 2144 BC		xij 2078 BC
xiij 2013 BC		xiu 1946 BC		xu 1881 BC
xuj 1816 BC		xuij 1749 BC		xuiij 1684 BC
xix 1618 BC		xx 1553 BC		xxj 1486 BC
xxij 1421 BC		xxiij 1356 BC		xxiu 1289 BC
xxu 1224 BC		xxuj 1158 BC		xxuij 1093 BC
xxuiij 1026 BC		xxix 961 BC		xxx 896 BC
xxxj 829 BC		xxxij 764 BC		xxxiij 698 BC
xxxiu 633 BC		xxxu 566 BC		xxxuj 501 BC

Interval is about 39 and a half years (39.4285714285714286 years), after which you have 99.524 % of original
89.75 pmc - 89.468 pmc = 0.282 pmc rise
99.524 % * 89.468 pmc = 89.04213232 pmc with zero replacement
Stays 89.468 pmc with 0.42586768 pmc replacement
0.42586768 + 0.282 pmc = 0.70786768 pmc replacement
0.70786768 / 0.42586768 = 1.6621775101599633

This latter being the ratio for C14 production then to now. Note : if equal all over the time from Djoser and Joseph (according to Syncellus) to 501 BC.

As we have seen, even a ratio of 20:1 is possible without disastrous consequences. This I made clear back in October 2015, with these words:

Les premiers 179 après le déluge, j’ai fait ajouter efficacement 36,32968 % du taux actuel ou 17 fois davantage, ce qui correspond à en moyenne 6,614647619047619034 milliSieverts par an du cosmos. Ce qui est à peu près l’exposition à Princeton, actuellement, si on ajoute aux 0.39 milliSieverts cosmiques tous les autres facteurs de radioactivité. J’ai fait abstraction du fait que l’ajout est en réalité plus haut, parce que contrepesé par la perte. Mais 7 ou même pas 8 milliSieverts par an, c’est ce qu’on peut compter au maximum comme moyenne ces 179 ans après le déluge. Selon mon petit modèle, bien entendu.

New blog on the kid : Avec un peu d'aide de Fibonacci ... j'ai une table, presque correcte
http://nov9blogg9.blogspot.com/2015/10/avec-un-peu-daide-de-fibonacci-jai-une.html

Mise-à-jour: À propos dangérosité. La radiation cosmique donne, par le monde en moyenne 0,39 milliSieverts par an, et l'exposition à milliSieverts est en moyenne dans le monde 3,01 milliSieverts par an. Aux États-Unis la moyenne est même 6,24 milliSieverts par an. 3*0,39 milliSieverts = 1,17. Ceci serait, pourvu que la production de carbone 14 est directement proportionnelle aux milliSieverts et non à leur carrée ou racine carrée, par exemple, l'exposition au temps d'Abraham, selon mon modèle ici exposé. Pour arriver à une identification entre Moïse et Amenamhat IV, il faudra peut-être un peu davantage, mais ceci ne serait pas un risque de santé aux temps d'Abraham. 1,17 est bien inférieur à 3,01 ou encore à 6,24!/HGL

New blog on the kid : Un essai, décision de demander l'aide à un professeur de maths
http://nov9blogg9.blogspot.com/2015/10/un-essai-decision-de-demander-laide-un.html

Unfortunately we probably cannot keep very close to the medium ratio of replacement of 1.6621775101599633.

For, suppose that we are also dealing with a match with Jericho? Kenyon's date for fall of walls, according to Syncellus just after 1644 BC, would be more or less an exact match, reaching 100 pmc or more, since Kenyon dated desztruction to ....

The destruction of Garstang’s City IV, which he had dated to about 1400 B.C.E., occurred, according to Kenyon, at the end of the Middle Bronze Age, about 1550 B.C.E.(14)

(14) Kenyon, Digging Up Jericho (London: Ernest Benn, 1957), p. 262; "Jericho," in Archaeology and Old Testament Study (AOTS) ed. D. Winton Thomas (Oxford: Clarendon, 1967), pp. 265- 267; "Jericho," in Encyclopedia of Archaeological Excavations in the Holy Land (EAEHL), vol. 2, ed. Michael Avi-Yonah (Englewood Cliffs, NJ: Prentice Hall, 1976), pp. 551, 564; The Bible in Recent Archaeology (Atlanta: John Knox, 1978), pp. 33-37.

Did the Israelites Conquer Jericho? A New Look at the Archaeological Evidence
Technical - mai 01, 2008 - by Bryant G. Wood PhD - on Associates for Biblical Research
http://www.biblearchaeology.org/post/2008/05/Did-the-Israelites-Conquer-Jericho-A-New-Look-at-the-Archaeological-Evidence.aspx

A real date of 1644 and a carbon date of 1550 mean too little time is measured, i e a higher carbon ratio than even 100 pmc.

Namely:

1644
1550
0094

94 years too little = a carbon content of 101.144 pmc when Jericho fell.

So, in 237 years the carbon content would have risen from 89.468 pmc to 101.144 pmc. Is this possible?

In 237 years, 100 pmc would drop to 97.174 pmc. 97.174 % * 89.468 pmc = 86.93963432 pmc. Which is what zero carbon 14 genesis would imply.

101.144 pmc
-86.93963432 pmc
=14.20436568 pmc replacement

The replacement with current carbon 14 building would be 100 - 97.174 = 2.826 pmc.

And this means that 14.20436568 / 2.826 = 5.0263148195329087 or more simply 5 times as fast as now is how carbon 14 would have been building in those years.

I think this may pose a problem for accepting the chronology of Syncellus, but it might not be insurmountable. Can anyone point to a destruction of Jericho which could be carbon dated to 2406 BC? That might solve it.

What about the time for St Jerome's chronology, between Joseph burying his father in Egypt close to the time, I am presuming when the Pharao Djoser was buried, and taking of Jericho?

1709 and 1510 - 40 = 1470. 2800 and 1550.

2800
1709
1091 extra years, 87.636 pmc

1550
1470
0080 extra years, 99.037 pmc.

With zero new C14, 87.636 pmc would drop to 97.15 % * 87.636 pmc = 85.138374 pmc

99.037 -
85.138374
= 13.898626 pmc

Well, just a little slower with St. Jerome than for Syncellus.

What about Ussher now? Taking of Jericho is given in Haydock as "Year of the World 2553, Year before Christ 1451."

2800
1635
1165 extra years, 86.855 pmc

1550
1451
0099 extra years, 98.81 pmc

1635-1451=184 years. 100 pmc would sink to 97.799 pmc. 97.799 % * 86.855 pmc = 84.94332145 pmc

Carbon building in this time:

98.81 pmc
- 84.94332145 pmc
= 13.86667855 pmc

Expected carbon building : 100 pmc - 97.799 pmc = a 2.201 pmc drop being compensated.

13.86667855 / 2.201 = 6.3001719900045434

So, carbon 14 would have been forming a bit more than 6 times faster than now.

I think this is a problem common to all of the scenarii.

Either I was wrong in identifying Joseph with Imhotep, though this is supported by the Hungere Stele, or Garstang was wrong in singling out his "City IV" as the one the destruction of walls of which are the destruction of Jericho, or between Joseph burying his father in Egypt and Joshua taking Jericho, carbon 14 was forming fairly fast. 5 to 6 times faster.

Or, these chronologies were wrong in taking the soujourn in Egypt as only half of the soujourn in "a land not your own", by adding 215 years to each of them, the carbon build up would have been somewhat slower than that. This would imply first pushing back the date of Joseph burying his father in Egypt:

1881
0215
2096 (Syncellus + 215)

1709
0215
1924 (St Jerome + 215)

1635
0215
1850 (Ussher + 215).

That also reduced the number or extra years and raises the pmc in the time of Joseph (obviously pmc in time of Genesis 14 would also be higher, since also pushed back 215 years).

2800
2096
0704 extra years, 91.836 pmc

237+215=452 years, carbon loss from 100 to 94.679 = from 91.836 pmc to 86.94940644 pmc with zero replacement:

101.144
-86.94940644
=14.19459356 pmc carbon production.

Expected replacement 5.321 pmc.

14.19459356 / 5.321 = 2.6676552452546514, between 2 and 3 (closer to 3) times as fast carbon build up as now.

2800
1924
0876 extra years, 89.945 pmc

Same loss ratio = from 89.945 pmc to 85.15902655 pmc with zero replacement.

99.037 -
85.15902655 =
13.87797345 pmc carbon rise.

Expected replacement identic, so 13.87797345 / 5.321 = 2.6081513719225709, similar ratio.

2800
1850
0950 extra years, 89.144 pmc

184+215=399 years. Carbon loss and expected replacement, from 100 to 95.288 pmc, 4.712 pmc.

Carbon loss in terms of pmc drop with zero replacement : 89.144 pmc * 95.288 % = 84.94353472 pmc

98.81 pmc -
84.94353472 pmc =
13.86646528 pmc real carbon production.

13.86646528 / 4.712 = 2.942798234295416, nearly 3 times as fast carbon 14 production as now.

I think if you prefer the traditional chronologies or prefer reducing the carbon 14 production speed in these times between Joseph and Joshua, both are feasible.

I am however not showing a table for the above values, which ignore Jericho, for now.

Hans Georg Lundahl
Nanterre UL
Sts Peter and Paul
29.VI.2017

Update, next day:

Jericho archaeology has produced two possibilities for the position of Joshua and the conquest of Jericho. One centers around the wall Garstang found.

Kenyon claimed this wall was from the Early Bronze III period, placing it from 2700-2200 BC, far too early for Joshua.

Source: Jericho Archaeology
[on Israel, a History of]
http://www.israel-a-history-of.com/jericho-archaeology.html

What was the carbon date I said would fit the slower buildup of carbon 14? Well, 2400 about. This would fit the wall of Jericho III.

So, the slower buildup of carbon 14 remains possible./HGL